End in sight for toxic and corrosive "needs" based allocation system?
30/08/2010 7:51 am
"How thousands of council homes go to foreigners"
A classic DM article without doubt. What a soft touch basket case of a country we have become.
However how much of this is grandstanding. Local connection is used by many LAs. That does not get them around the law however. Will Shapps bite the bullet and reform the definition of statutory homelessness that the second and third worlders use all the time to get an allocation? The noises are right but without legal reform, they are precisely that and nothing will change on the ground...
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06/09/2010 7:01 pm
Let me deal with each of the points Anon 3pm 5 sept makes.
The 3m figure is a falsehood created by MW and is not the official or a reliable figure. Secondly, this errant MW figure is gross immigration, that is it doesnt take into account those that have emigrated (net immigration figure.) Thirdly, the official figures include British people who are coming back to live in UK (mostly I assume those Brits that emigrate to Spain, Italy France etc and then return to live in UK) - Yes bizarre as it may sound British people and British citzens are classed s immigrants!
So while the official figures overstate immigration and are theselves errant, the MW figures add 66% onto the gross immigration figure and are wildly inaccurate.
You accuse the Equality and Human Rights Commission (EHRC) of being racist? I have no idea why. The report however does discuss correctly the legal position on which immigrants are entitled to social housing and - more importantly - those that are not. These include asylum seekers and many other categories of 'immigrant'; whereas the knowingly false posits of ILAG et al (and other anonymous people such as yourself) using MW figures would have us believe that social housing is being ravaged by "third-world immigrants" - This is not the case at all as the law and the figures I quoted bear this out.
Hence the impact on social housing in terms of allocation is minimal. Yet while errant racist driven premises that say all black faced asylum seekers take all the social housing stock from indigenous white British people remain the level of debate, however fundamentally flawed that is, then people will believe it and want to believe it rather than looking at the real problems.
Yet as soon as the facts are presented you are labelled as 'wacist' by the real racist buffoons on here - a not so clever way of avoiding debate.
06/09/2010 3:42 pm
Exactly, if you count them when they come in, you got to count them when they go out too.
since 97, is you take an (conservative) average of £300,000 per year leaving the country in 13 years that's almost 4 millions who left.
06/09/2010 3:33 pm
'IPS estimates also show that Poland was the most popular country of next residence for non-British emigrants in 2008, with 50,000 people migrating there.'
Thats all the Poles going home because the boom went bust.
05/09/2010 3:12 pm
the following article is from NATIONAL STATISTICS ONLINE.
Could you digest it and tell me hosw many people have left the country since 97?
"""The number of people leaving the UK for 12 months or more reached a record high in 2008, with an estimated 427,000 people emigrating. This was up from 341,000 in 2007 and 398,000 in 2006. This rise was as a result of a 50 per cent increase in
non-British citizens emigrating from 169,000 in 2007 to 255,000 in 2008. Just over half of the 86,000 increase were citizens of the
A8 Accession countries which joined the EU in 2004.
An estimated 590,000 people arrived to live in the UK in 2008, the second highest figure on record after 596,000 in 2006. This compared with 574,000 in 2007 and represents a continuation of the level of immigration seen since 2004. Of all immigrants 505,000 (86 per cent) were non-British citizens in 2008.
Net migration, the difference between immigration and emigration, decreased from 233,000 in 2007 to 163,000 as a result of increased emigration.
There has been a large increase in the number of people emigrating for work related reasons, particularly those with a definite job to go to. In 2008 an estimated 136,000 people emigrated from the UK to take up a definite job, compared with 100,000 in 2007.
The International Passenger Survey (IPS) is the main component of these Long-Term International Migration estimates. IPS estimates allow a more detailed analysis of the characteristics of international migrants. This reveals that the increase in emigration of non-British citizens was most notable in the 25 to 44 age group, consistent with higher numbers of people emigrating for work related reasons. The IPS shows an increase in the number of non-British citizens leaving the UK to take up a definite job – up from 45,000 in 2007 to 62,000 in 2008.
IPS estimates also show that Poland was the most popular country of next residence for non-British emigrants in 2008, with 50,000 people migrating there.""""
05/09/2010 3:02 pm
Anonymous and Ilag,
Ok, so both of you in agreement withthe Daily Mail are telling me about 3 milliono of immigrants since 97... Now, if Labour was not in power in this period, are you seriously telling me that ANY form of DEMOCRATIC governemnt would have been able to reduce this immigration drastically?
How could Uk governemnts have they done so when no other western country, included russia, with all sorts of right wing governements have not been able to do so in their countries?
The only type of governements capable of reducing drastrically immgiration are NOrth Korea and China, which are not Democratic governements.
Is that the kind of governemt you believe UK should have so we can stop immigration then, because not other Democratic electred governemnt can ever do it, included David Cameron?
05/09/2010 3:00 pm
Joe, too right your post on the 31/08/10 was clocked. That was the one where you quoted figures from EHRC, thus ensuring that you no intention of pursuing a reasoned argument based on objective data.
The EHRC is a racist organisation, which many of us sincerely hope is not long for the world and probably wont be past the October spending review.
Why don't you take your figures from MigrationWatch? And deal with big figure once again - 3m immigrants came into country in the 13 years since 1997; what was the impact on housing provision in the UK.
05/09/2010 2:47 pm
ILAG, if Kass thinks like an android (whatever that means) you clearly think and express your opinion like the racist bigot that you clearly are. Why dont you clarify why you always say 'third-world' immigrant for example and not just immigrant? Further why do you continually insist that immigrants get social housing when the facts dont bear this out?
No doubt you will try to deflect as usual and label me as you have done many times before as some 'wabid lefty' - and yes Elmer Fudd does spring to mind every time you write that and thats apt!.
My earlier post on this 31/08 you seem to have conveniently ignored, How surprising you do so when facts that disprove your rants appear?
Just to jog your memory: -
Greater than 90% of social housing allocated is to UK born persons.
11% of foregin nationals live in social housing yet 17% of British people do.
"New migrants to the UK over the last five years make up less than 2% of the total of those in social housing" As the last 5 years would include the period from 2004 then this includes the A8 nationals from Poland et al (and the A2 nationals).
There are more Germans in the UK than Bangladeshis, Jamaicans, Nigerians, Kenyans, and almost 3 times the number of Somalians (ILAG's favourite) Ghanians, and 5 times the number of Ugandans and Afghanis.
There are more Americans in the UK than any African country with the exception of South Africa.
So the less than 10 per cent of non UK born persons getting social housing will include Germans, Americans, South Africanss and of course not forgetting Irish, Canadians, Australians and New Zealanders... and French, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Dutch and a few other white peoples.
So the majority of immigrants in the UK are from FIRST WORLD countries and they are white
05/09/2010 12:24 pm
Ilag, you talk like England is somewhere out of space, where you live... Name one single first world country which has not had the same level and even higher ones than England... IN USA more people are speaking spanish than english... Russia seems to be a coutnry with the highest immigration rate at the moment... So what?... Things change, empires fall, new ones begin, you might not want to be part of history but you'll have just come along with it as you have no choice...
Of course new people or cutlures coming over bring new demands? so what? a country of our level of civilization has to be able to absorb and adapt, the more rigid you ask it to be the more new problems you will get, without solving the old ones, including social housing.
05/09/2010 12:08 pm
Err...being half Irish I don't think I'd be blaming them or any other neighbour. The problem is with the unprecedented amount of third world immigration that has taken place since '97 - as the electorate correctly spotted. Which is why your lot were removed from power. I kept having to remind lefties of this for some reason. Try reading a newspaper or watching the news sometime. Your ideas are history. Got that?